Well, bye then, because I don’t really give a shit whether or not someone’s a hypocrite, I care about the impact their actions have on the world. When I spoke about animal suffering, it’s because I actually want it to end. Whether or not the people who help end it live up to a externally-imposed standard some…

I see - so when you talk about the torture, exploitation, and killing of animals, that’s not the issue you actually care about. No, what’s much more important is whether the people trying to fix that issue are hypocrites.

Well, if the point is not to kill animals, than killing fewer animals is obviously better, yes. Obviously killing no animals would be preferable, but again, in modern society that would require either being able to grow 100% of your own food, or starving to death.

So you don’t actually care about exploited brown people, you just wanted to use them as a stick to bash vegans with, even though a vegan diet exploits far fewer people than the average Western diet does?

So if you were forced to either strangle a puppy or pull up a weed, you’d be unable to choose, because both acts are equally terrible?

So if you were forced to either strangle a puppy or pull up a weed, you’d be unable to choose, because both acts are equally terrible?

You had moved on to talking about how privileged vegans are for not eating luxury foods.

I never said that medicinal animal testing is fair - my point was simply that when it comes to how we treat animals, it’s a very, very small portion of the issue. I want us to find alternatives to medicinal animal testing, but it seems unlikely when society still sees it as acceptable to factory farm and kill billions…

In fairness to the Conversation article, I don’t think they were trying criticize vegans - although some of the solutions they came up with were already covered under the “as far as is practical and possible,” clause, so I think they have a poor understanding of the concept of veganism.

Dude, animals eat too. And although cattle and sheep can get some of their food via grazing, most of what farm animals eat is livestock feed. Which means humans had to grow crops to make that livestock feed - over a third of the world’s cropland is used to fatten up animals instead of feed humans. In the USA,…

You’re blaming the wrong people, I think. As far as I can tell, the fellow who wrote the article isn’t actually vegan, just hypothesizing about what people who are vegan should and shouldn’t eat.

The US is one of the cheapest places to buy animal products in the world, thanks to heavy subsidizing, which leads to them being consumed in such great quantities that there literally isn’t enough land on the planet to support such a diet on a worldwide scale.

As mentioned, the salad involves killing and displacing significantly fewer of those animals than an equivalent amount of animal products. You’re effectively complaining that vegans A) don’t have the ability to hunt/grow 100% of their own food, and B) aren’t willing to starve to death to meet your standards. Standards…

I sort of assumed the definition applied to individuals, not just our survival as a species. It doesn’t seem fair to ask individuals to die of a curable disease for the sake of achieving perfect veganism - especially when the rest of society makes no effort to be vegan at all.

Ehhh, depends on what the medical care or medication is needed for I guess, and whether there are alternatives available.

As far as I can tell, the guy who wrote that article wasn’t actually vegan.

Because animals have to eat too, and they have to eat a lot more food than they can produce, it takes more crops to produce farmed animal products on an industrial scale than it does to produce an equivalent amount of plant-based food. (This includes grazed animals, whose diets are usually supplemented with livestock…

Dude, animals eat too. And although cattle and sheep can get some of their food via grazing, most of what farm animals eat is livestock feed. Which means humans had to grow crops to make that livestock feed - over a third of the world’s cropland is used to fatten up animals instead of feed humans. In the USA,…

Not to mention it takes more plants to make animal products than it does to make plant-based food. Farm animals gotta eat too, they mostly eat plants, and they have to eat a hell of a lot more food than they can produce.

AFAIK, the guy who wrote that Conversation piece isn’t vegan, nor were the people who wrote the QI question that inspired the article. It’s just a bunch of non-vegans hypothesizing on how vegans SHOULD eat.