I agree that the "ashes" formulation is hackneyed. But I just don't see how any article about New Order that closes with "Ceremony" can really get around mentioning Joy Division. And like I said elsewhere, I'm actually one of those who prefer NO to JD - greater emotional and musical range, you know?

PINEAPPLE FACE

I think if separation was important to the band, they wouldn't have named both the JD and NO compilations Substance, or released Joy Division & New Order - Before & After: The BBC Sessions (this was what they were supporting when I saw that 1/2 and 1/2 set) , or put that spotlight on the empty mic stand in Curtis'…

Today, one band would just sue the other into oblivion. The old passive-aggressive ways were better, especially since every one of the songs we got out of this feud was great.

I always thought that NO's "All The Way" (which basically rips "Just Like Heaven"'s bassline) might have been payback.

The Radiohead "Ceremony" isn't bad, but the G500 one is almost - ALMOST - great enough to surpass NO's for me.

Except they didn't always go in a totally different direction, as "Ceremony" and "Procession" and "In a Lonely Place" show. There's a continuity there. When I saw NO play live, they played a set that was exactly 1/2 NO songs, 1/2 JD songs. You just can't really totally separate the bands.

I don't expect to change your mind, but that song to me shows how NO was able to rework genius and make it even better. The OP notes that the "Eyes" lines get moved for greater impact, and changing "It hurts me to see you this way" to "It hurts me to treat you this way" takes the line from a cliche to something…

That first Arcade Fire album has bits of Hook/NO, Bunnymen, Siouxsie, Bjork and (breaking with the eighties postpunk) Modest Mouse all over it. I like it, but as an old man I did have to roll my eyes a little when the kids were acting like this sound had never been heard before.

I only have one (Music for Pleasure). I bought all the Electronic albums though.

That's not really a fair comparison though. JD were hugely-influential on their own, a more or less foundational pillar to the post-punk and goth genres.

Peter Hook is one of my favorite bassists of all time, a hugely-influential bass player, and New Order isn't New Order without him.

To be fair, Morrissey wishes a lot of people would die.

You should have asked him if he could sign Ian Curtis' name, like he admitted to doing on JD memorabilia for hawking to unsuspecting fans online.

"Ceremony"'s got a…fierce melancholy, somehow. The way Sumner slashes at those chords, almost rushing them. There's such a contrast between the elegance of the arrangement (you could not add nor subtract anything from/to that song to make it any more perfect), and the energy of the performance, and the sadness of…

Here's some support for your argument though (and The Jam are good here too):

Well, you probably need the Who and Zep in there somewhere, and rough contemporaries Rourke/Joyce and Mills/Berry were no slouches.

That Taras video is awesome, and is on YouTube:

I kind of dissed "Fine Time" above, and to be clear, it's a…fine dance track, on its own.

Eh, if it is, then so's "Procession", but who cares? One band actually recorded it in the studio and one didn't.