I know there was some freedom, but can't be bothered enough with Indycar to crawl all over the regs - I have no problem with admitting that. The cars started our ugly and ended up ugly, which is my complaint. They have got progressively more ugly since Champcar. I am not saying the mods are ineffective in terms of…

It's the regulations that makes them ugly, not the performance gains. Marketing drives racing. It's harder to sell ugly cars than good looking ones.

Do they look sufficiently different? Yes. Do they look sufficiently less like apiece of crap that has wings stuck on as an afterthought?

I'll bet if a bolt came loose the team would absolutely not be highlighting the accident on the internet...

But that is all a rotisserie is. We used to build BTCC cars on a spit that consisted of precisely that - I think the guys took a morning to make them, if I recall correctly. This was for a major automotive manufacturer. It really is a simple device, a car rotisserie. If you have the fabrication skill, compared to…

Sure, little angry man. I appreciate that you feel somehow slighted that someone else has a different opinion than you do and wildly different professional experience in racing.

Er. I do have evidence for my opinion - I have the couple of decades of working in motor racing full time. Working for and being around shops at the most levels of racing competition. The experience of which led me to wonder why someone else was doing it differently. That difference was explained.

They're called spits, where I'm from. Regional differences and all that.

Oh, now you're getting political? That's funny. If you're trying to get your troll hat on fully, it won't work with me, sunshine.

As I have said in other replies - I was assuming they'd strip the car down to the shell and build a full cage from there. Because that is what is done in the racing I have come from. At the point of assuming they started with a shell at some point, I don't know why you wouldn't put it on a spit. It's easier when…

Well, I said stool. But I've welded on both and it's not terrible. I can't weld upside down for more than ten seconds at a time, but I also get car sick easily. I suspect the two are related.

I saw the same thing but I couldn't find any images of the GT3 Car - I'll wager that is through the bulkheads. I don't know why I can't ask questions and talk about the project without so many people (not you) getting all huffy and trying to berate me for calling them 'wrong' when I didn't at all. It's just not what…

What about the fact they're not even going through the dash? What your'e saying doesn't conflict with my statement "you want the cage to go to (or as near as possible) the suspension mounts front and rear". But I struggle to understand why you can't take a cage through to the rear mounts - because unless the engine is…

Let me clarify that 'half assed cage' comment - I don't mean it as any reflection at all on the quality of work. Not at all. More as in the scope of the cage - it's not a 'full cage' , so is only half-assed in that respect. The client - not the fabricators - dictate the scope of the cage and obviously have chosen…

I have welded a small to reasonable amount myself (by pro standards), but have also worked in and ran shops with professional fabricators building Pro level race cars as well as building my own at home on occasion. I am no n00b to welding or race cars.

My pretend shops that I have done this in, and the ones that I have seen it done in are the same size or smaller than the one in the pictures. I've seen a car on a spit in a double garage before. It doesn't need a ton more space - the spit takes up maybe 2 feet either end of the car and you just need the extra space…

Right - I was assuming a full cage, in which case he'd have had to get into wheel arches, engine bays and front non-engine bay and more upside down welding. If the cage is much less comprehensive than I assumed it would be then the cost benefit in time alone doesn't make sense to mount it on a spit.

Technically, yes. Just make it stronger. You just have to make sure the fluids don't leak out, normally be removing them, but it's not something that is done routinely as it becomes a bit unwieldy to turn it when it is that heavy, though. It's better to do it as a bare chassis.

Because you want the cage to go to (or as near as possible) the suspension mounts front and rear, which means going through the front bulkhead and into the engine bay. Chassis stiffness and very big crashes dictate tying as much of the car into the cage as possible. It impacts the safety of the cage considerably if it…

Not uncommon, no. But not as easy as welding right side up. There are lots of build benefits to having the car on a spit, too.