I had to hook up a new Toyota Tundra to a trailer at work and that was really dang handy. Might have to break the piggy soon

Because Erdogan is such an angel. This is what happens when you have a Cold War mentality. You don’t care who you support, as long as it’s not Russia, so your kind supported ISIL in its early days as it destroyed Syria and Libya, called them protesters or freedom fighters. Your kind are the ones who call shooting a…

Yep. Turkey has long used their standing in NATO to cover their illegal activities. Unfortunately, no one in NATO has the guts to boot them out, and now world peace could easily hang on the decisions of Erdogan, the man who gassed protesters, funds ISIL, is a habitual liar, and most likely rigged the last election.

Have you ever been in the cockpit of a plane? The best visibility I have ever had was in an An-2, with its huge windows, and it still sucked. Unless the missile is coming from the front (which it wasn’t, it came from the 5 o’clock position) then you aren't going to see it.

Covered up fake space launches? Where are you getting this?

The engagement range is tiny at those speeds of it is in a tail chase, and depending on its launch platform.

Defending by shooting at a parachuting pilot?

This just highlights why I absolutely hate Turkey. It is dry and tasteless. And then I hate it that people think we need to eat it every year! And then I have to hear about how other relations can cook it better!

Yah. And cruise missiles just make things weirder. It is boggling to me that you can fire off a shot in Denver and hit a target in Houston. The ranges are just insane.

A lot of stars aligned for KAL007 that weren’t present here (pilots on the wrong course, recent airspace violations of an RC-135, climb that was interpreted as an evasive maneuver). The pilot did see it as a passenger plane But did not report it, which was the primary failure he probably figured that it would be…

Russia considers all terror groups opposing Assad ISIL. That’s pretty simple to understand why because they are all either fighting for ISIL or fighting ISIL’s common enemy, which is still supporting ISIL, like it or not.

I still think it interesting that some people can’t break out of their Cold War mentality. It’s like how the U.S. Declares there are no moderate rebels left in Syria, then Russia starts supporting Assad and then the U.S. Starts supplying weapons to “moderates” again, even though in all likelihood the weapons will…

As I have said before, The best way to break up NATO is to try to force its members into a war they don’t want to fight against an enemy They don’t hate who attacked an ally they don’t like who shot an airplane down in dubious circumstances.

Yah, they didn't even intercept. I guess this just highlights why you really want a well trained military. A single soldier with an itchy finger can spark a huge conflict. Looking back, this makes me proud of our actions throughout the Cold War. We never got into a shooting match.

Thanks for the link!

Yep. I don’t want to point to strongly at the left side of the political isle but I am pointing over there :P

Hmm, interesting thought. I had never thought that perhaps they might respond and “help” just not to the degree that Turkey would wish.

KAL 007 flew out of the airspace, but it was definitely shot in Soviet airspace without question. That's why they failed to take adequate precautions, because they didn't want to shoot it after it left

As I previously outlined, aggressively defending their airspace would have entailed the airplane getting hit in Turkish airspace and/or debris falling in Turkey. While I have no doubt they established a lock on the Su-24 while it was in Turkish airspace, but I am doubtful they fired while it was in Turkish space and…

But it would fit into Putins narrative because he really has pushed the idea that NATO is worthless. If he could try to push NATO members into a situation that forces them into defending Turkey even though they don’t want to, he might accomplish exactly what he wants. I can guarantee that if that was the case, almost…