I never said no men would. I said there are significant numbers of men to whom it doesn't matter. Aaaand I'm going to stop here, because you apparently can't read worth shit.

The other reasons are valid, but cost of adoption isn't really an issue compared to the cost of these surgeries...

Working out is kind of its own sport? There's also a certain culture and euphoria from measurable achievements.

Even if it were true, what does anyone else's preference in the bedroom have to do with anything?

What does the number of adult men who work out have to deal with it? All of the guys I know who are "into" working out do it for the sake of working out and getting buff, and girls are only tangential to the equation, if present at all.

Story is a huge part of marketing, though. If you wanted to be cynical/technical about it, 99% of all marketing is making up stories to manipulate people into buying stuff.

Lol because they were just posing for the meme.

I brought women up because you seem to think those traits are traits of masculinity?

"He doesn't care about her opinion being different because the difference between opinions was never of interest to begin with."

"The world moves around you".... wow, that is egotistical.

Yeah. But if advertising something as "manly" to get them to try something different it's not necessarily a bad thing. It's extremely sad that they are afraid of touching anything deemd "unmanly" with a 10-foot pole, but if it gets them to broaden their views even a little it's at least not terrible.

This. For any given group, assholes always yell loudest.

Because being honest with each other about what you want is out of the question?

If you need a woman to provide a sounding board for you or be submissive in order for you to feel masculine, you're really not masculine. At all.

What would you call argumentative or bitchy?

And here I thought most high school boys wanted more body mass to avoid being beat up in the locker room.

I don't think it's not a problem. But it's up to men to take that up, because we don't really know how you feel about the representation of men in media.

I actually like the third site. It's very informative on a number of subjects, and is interesting to read. Though utterly useless to me unless I'm dressing my husband.

I'm not saying that we should try to design for various kinds of body types; I just felt that Penguin was a getting a lot of flak for that statement because it was being misinterpreted. Though the argument seemed to get kind of heated on both sides downthread...

You sure it wasn't the person you were replying to that did it? The person directly upthread of you can always delete your posts.