The New Porsche Panamera has a all gloss black center stack and screen. The one thing they added though was some actual toggle and buttons so it wasn’t all you touched but not much different than the Caddy system as far as how much gloss black there is and how much gloss black you touch. You don’t get a choice in it…

Agreed Agreed Agreed. I sat in every car in this segment and wasn’t blown away by any of the material choices cause they were all the same soft touch, hard plastics and leather in all the same areas. The instrument panel was/is embarrassing, and the switch gear on the doors were parts bin, but in contrast everything…

Hide ya Sedans, Hide ya Coupes, Hide ya wagons ya’ll... Wall Street be coming for them.

I grew up on domestics and at a time I’d just willingly bashed the products, in many cases,it was well deserved. The quality was awful and the Big 3 rarely had a product I was excited for in terms of an affordable/exciting. I wanted them to be successful but when the efforts weren’t there no mercy.

I agree. In a lot of cases it’s hard to shake an old reputation. Honda and Toyota would have to do some royal f**k ups to tarnish their long standing reliable/well built image. It’s well earned of course, just a shame when you consider looking at it purely by the product itself and beyond the brand who built it.

I think the cargument was done and done when Kristen said “Fuck Ass.” I can’t disagree with that indeed you are a fuck ass with said bumper sticker.

Dude who cares about the pure metrics when a good car (and in this day and age) goes down we all suffer. Plus more competition the better the product. Lets be honest Toyota and Honda started to care more about that segment when Ford started stealing sales from them. The new Accord design is testament to that a good…

I do find it odd I looked as Sales and they were still strong and over 200k a year. But... a 100k down from it’s 2014 and 2015 numbers. But still 200k is a lot for that car and segment. When they said they weren’t going to refresh the exterior and interior design I knew they were going to can it over in North America.…

I do understand the frustration though. I didn’t buy my car new I bought it CPO’ed for nearly half the cost . Warranty was still in effect and I wanted 4 doors with strong handling characteristics. I also didn’t have the money at the time to afford to have 2 cars, one for performance driving and another for day to day…

Not sure where you get the idea that a ATS 3.6 fully loaded costs more than a Fully Loaded S4. $52k for the Caddy and $65-67 for the S4 with equivalent options. It’s till $10-14k more than the Caddy. I definitly agree that Audi has some of the best interior’s in the business but all the Germans with equal content have…

Llamas this discussion is about Llamas

You also Realize that Performance 2 Door Cars are not a OEM’s Money making venture/capital. Cause you’re coming across like a bean counter as oppose to a Car guy.

You also Realize that Performance 2 Door Cars are not a OEM’s Money making venture/capital. Cause you’re coming across like a bean counter as oppose to a Car guy.

Trucks are what supporting the majority of these cars at the moment with the exception to the Mustang to a certain extent. So your goal for brand equity is…

Flop

Also these Articles are 2 years old this doesn’t tell the story for the past 3 years.

huh....

Not Sure where you get the idea it was a “FLOP” When it out sold the Challenger 2 years in a row it’s current (6th) Gen form. It took me all of 2 seconds to look this up. Also not sure how you define a flop in that car segment. If it sold less than 10k a year, sure but 70k +/- a year is far from a flop.

Sales are down…

Not Sure where you get the idea it was a “FLOP” When it out sold the Challenger 2 years in a row it’s current (6th) Gen form. It took me all of 2 seconds to look this up. Also not sure how you define a flop in that car segment. If it sold less than 10k a year, sure but 70k +/- a year is far from a flop.

Sales are…

1999 Toyota 4 Runner