MICTURATING MITHRAS…FUCK!

Moderation helps, as does having a separate review to talk stuff over. This review is very likely the one where I'll talk the most about the books, simply because it's among the very biggest spoilers and one that we've been waiting to share with y'all for literally the entire existence of the show.

You'll want to wait until the end of season 4 to read book 3, since this happens about halfway in. There's still some real "holy shit!" moments left.

@avclub-e4a4b9fd3156c8e7a1c6452e9ac3b09a:disqus  Not to mention the murder plot was long in the works before Melisandre ever met Gendry.

Yeah, but at least we could throw our books across the room when it happened. Or refuse to read the next page as it was happening. I'm guessing there's more than a handful of people who need new TV's tonight.

It's especially a problem when watching one hour at a time. When I get the DVD's and watch 2-3 episodes at once, I feel like there's some propulsive plot movement. But a weekly check-in with half the characters doesn't do as much even when the individual episodes are excellent.

This is now my canon for the aftermath of the Red Wedding.

Sorry, @bigwhale.

That was almost certainly a nod to the book readers, Grey Wind does get loose in the books and raises some hell before being killed. I was all excited for that and instead he just gets shot through the windows in his kennel. :(

Yes, because Jaime's story has nothing in it that can be confused with a redemptive arc :-p

I think that's what makes the Red Wedding work from a storytelling aspect. It doesn't come out of nowhere, it comes from Robb's own decisions. That doesn't make it hurt less, but it means that the story is strengthened rather than compromised by this gut punch.

Tormund also pulled her away from chasing after Jon, he wasn't trying to kill her.

@beema I think that's where the real complaint is to be found. The Red Wedding is completely justified in the story but we watch TV and read books to get away from the unending horror story that is real life. If you're reading/watching for a story where the good don't get fucked over, you're going to be legitimately…

@avclub-b5b9b849fc7d60c361ba33013821b7f9:disqus  The North is pretty sparsely populated, but as large as the rest of the kingdom combined. It would basically be like the east and west coast trying to occupy the midwest and mountain west of the US.

Even better, it works backwards in time!

Hey, that's what I say about Canadians.

If you were one of the Tully bannermen and the Tully's came to you asking for your men to overthrow Walder Frey because he was a miserable jerk, and take the Frey's land to give to some up-jumped loyal knight or minor lord, would you feel super comfortable about your own family holding onto your title if you ever…

@avclub-9b972ab65a176d0a3aabf71ea0c01ffc:disqus Balon Greyjoy is a Lord Paramount on the level of Tywin and Robb, Walder Frey is a step below them, but very powerful.  Balon doesn't have many troops, but he has one of the largest navies in Westeros. He's kind of a big deal.

He did say to give Robb his regards to Bolton.

@avclub-b90391459007fbc002dee3084fef650b:disqus Well, I'm not sure the Bolton's are going to be on the Christmas card list from the other northern families after killing their fathers and brothers at a wedding.