That'll teach him to take responsibility for his actions! G.W. Bush NAILED it with that "I regret people heard those comments" after he called what's-his-face an asshole.

Ugh, this is the kind of shit that forces me to admit that the "boooo call-out culture!!" crowd (kind of) has a point.

Maybe in a civil trial, I could agree with that. But for a criminal trial, "She swore under oath that he never did anything to her, now she's swearing under oath that he did, which one is the lie?" would be any 1st year attorney's go-to strategy, and it's basically reasonable doubt wrapped up in a Christmas bow.

Later on when she starts holding hands with Sanders, people are probably just going to roll with it these days.

I really don't understand this. I mean, from a legal standpoint I do - Kesha's case pretty much went up in flames the second she categorically denied any of the alleged assault happening (while under oath) during a deposition. You can't lie under oath at one point and expect to be believed the next moment (And I say…

This sucks, because everything I've seen Doctor Luke say in regards to this case indicates he's a vindictive asshole who's turning the screws as much as possible with this. So, fuck him, really.

I think it speaks a lot to what kind of person you are that you're NOT angry about someone getting death threats. Since when did that become something people are expected to just brush off? Because she's PROBABLY not going to get murdered by some MRA nutjob, she should just suck it up? Listen to yourself.

Jesus, looking at the comments for this in other places where it's been posted… Here's a PSA for MRA-types out there frothing at the mouth over this.

The Holiday "season" for the holiday in question starts exactly when the CANDY for said holiday shows up on shelves, I thought everyone knew this already? If you go by decorations, you're going to have some cognitive dissonance when Christmas starts right after your kid goes back to school.

They most stop actively moderating threads at some point, because this thread has gotten REALLY weird since I last checked in

I'm thinking at this point we've just come to a difference opinion. I am specifically trying to be careful in my analysis, on both ends.

"You can feel how you want about it" implies I'm coming to a conclusion based on nothing but my own suppositions. Kesha has lied about this, and that IS relevant. Anyone who is attempting to have an honest discussion about this can admit to that.

"this is a man's life and livelihood at stake" is where you're going to lose people, Zoe. I agree that you don't seem to be pursuing a malignant agenda here, so let me explain this to you. I used to always feel the same way about these arguments and I would get unbelievably frustrated when it seemed like people just…

No, that's not what I'm saying (you're not the only one to get that though, so clearly I worded it poorly)

I am re-thinking and there's a point you made that I didn't do a good job of outright stating I 100% agree with: Many of the comments on here ARE the type of bigoted, ugly comments that would dissuade a rape victim from coming forward.

Sure, I can see your point, really. The only way this can get solved so the general populace can come to an opinion that's actually informed is for things to go through the court system. It does indeed suck that Dr. Luke has to pay a bunch of legal fees, although in fairness so does Kesha. She's not inflicting any…

I think it's victim-blaming behavior because they're basically saying "You did it to yourself, idiot" when Kesha is doing precisely what someone in her position is supposed to do.

So we're on the same page about that, then. I'm not even sure where we disagree then (if we even do). My only point in all of this is the same one I keep doggedly making despite the huge amounts of pushback I tend to get: I think if someone wants to make a reasonable, intelligent decision for THEMSELVES about who is…

Same to you! You have an intelligent, reasonable viewpoint, even if I don't agree with it. I wish I could argue with more people like you.

You are more than welcome to come up with your own, better way to resolve the issue. In the absence of that, I'm still kind of stuck with the current legal system. (Assuming I don't just want to spout my own opinion regardless of "facts" or "evidence")