Yay for worthless degrees! My undergrad and graduate degree are both in history.

They actually have a quite prolific military history. Their neutrality is a relatively recent thing. They fought quite a bit, it just didn’t equate to massive territorial changes.

And the Russians

I don’t think anyone’s conclusion is that humans are peaceful naturally. Quite the opposite.

Yeah it’s a different world for sure. My father is a plank owner with SEAL team 2 (was UDT, became a SEAL when all UDT was turned into SEALs). Did a tour as UDT, then another as a SEAL.

FYI, the Slava class Moskva’s VLS tubes house the naval variant of the S-300. The missiles on the rails are much shorter OSA-Ms (old).

Eh, yes and no. There are multiple stories where this horse has been beaten into the grave and back again.

Believe it or not, the Iraqis are finally starting to show that they’re very slowly getting a handle on things. It was about mid-summer when Daesh advances were checked, and since then, many have been killed with territory retaken by either the IA/Shiite AND Sunni militias, or the Kurds

I’m with ya. Could Turkey have held off? Sure they could have. But after everything you mentioned should they have? Who knows. But, you can bet your ass that the US would kill an intruder they warned 10 ten times and it still crossed the border. How much of an incursion doesn’t matter. When those F-16s went after that…

Negative ghostrider. Actually locking up an aircraft ups the ante considerably. A Growler popping a radar site because it’s locking up American aircraft would be completely reasonable. Putin knows this. Russia MIGHT do it with the Turks, but he has no reason to do it with other NATO members, nor will he.

How can you not know? The US invests EXTREMELY heavily in emission study/capture/etc. We’re pretty good at it.

I was somewhat with you until you waded into the classic blunder.

Ya know, I thought maybe I was losing my shit so i asked half a dozen people at my house over the holidays if they had any trouble deciphering that. Sure enough, no issues...crystal clear.

Appreciate it. I’m always getting hammered around here for being a jerk, and I am, frequently. I just don’t appreciate people dogpiling on Andrew. He’s always respectful and open minded but he’s Russian and proud of his country. I have no beef with that. He’s certainly not one of the paid Putin trolls that people try…

wow

What is hard to understand? That’s about as crystal clear as i can put it.

That’s a little different situation. Mainly because they are both NATO members. Nevertheless I hear ya. Trust me, I’m not exactly approving of Turkey’s actions either. They remind of the little brother that punches their older brother then runs and hides behind mom.

They really don’t though, that’s the beef. Don’t get me wrong, you’re 100% right in terms of ‘why’. It’s just that violating someone’s ADZ is one thing. ADZ is simply a buffer zone that starts before someone’s sovereign airspace. It gets violated continually and the antagonist is simply escorted out. Actually…

Apologies if I was harsh with you. I made it personal and probably shouldn’t have. You were just posting some pretty heinous bullshit. Refusing to decry Russia on certain things isn’t the same thing as supporting them.

Yeah, back before they dissolved the 11H infantry series, I used to see humvee/TOW assets smoke-check helo’s all the time.