i didn't interpret that scene as alison giving in to please him. we had a scene of alison faking an orgasm so he would just be over and done with, the woods scene looks very different to me.

wrong. i can assure you that even the scene in tess has been debated plenty, by actual academics (i read it in school and I remember this debate very well). you just need to look it up.

is it right to discuss this scene as if its a single slice of real life and not a carefully scripted and filmed television show with a point?

i don't understand the point you're making. yes, she's with him because she wants to. no that doesn't mean he can just take sex whenever it suits him.
and yes I agree, this season she never looked like she's enjoying sex very much, but this is another matter.

Make up your mind however you like. No one is stopping you. I just think you should extend that courtesy to others.

if it's a joke, then I didn't get it.

No one is claiming that in real life all rape is met with verbal or physical resistance.

how so very terrible of me. terrible.

A) that's sexist

As much as it pains me deeply to come off as internalizing misogyny and hashtagging NotAllMen

sex is not THE problem for alison, but it's definitely part of it, because she uses it as a form of soothing. it's like a drug addict, in a way. she wasn't that far off from understanding what to do to heal, but I guess is all gone down the drain now.

what? if someone is telling me "well he's touching her so it must be good to her as well" they clearly don't know what they're talking about.

would you feel better if I said "some men" instead of just "men"? there, SOME men and this specific case Black Mask, can be ridiculous in the lengths they go to defend what they don't consider rape. happy now?

i don't think you remember it well. they argue, they start kissing, he says let's go inside and she says no. at that point cole turns her around and asks her "is this what you want?" and she says "yes". trust me, I binge watched the thing in the last week, so it's fresh in my mind :) what it implied in the pilot is…

In Noah's defense, he did seem to be fingering Alison/massaging her mons pubis while fucking her. So I'm not sure he was the only one deriving pleasure from the experience.

my guess is that she just convinced herself it's noah's. her reaction "oh how weird she usually doesn't like strangers" wouldn't make sense otherwise.

exactly. i don't see how can anyone defend him??? she told him she was using sex just to feel, that she's aware of that now and that she needs time and what does he do? he goes and takes that away from her. i mean, even if you don't want to call it rape it's abusive nonetheless, and not the "unexpected sex sometimes…

she doesn't freeze up? no, she just passively take it, after telling him that this whole sex thing is something she's used to feel ANYTHING because she's dead inside. they made it pretty clear since the pilot, when she's having sex with cole. it's the equivalent of those cuts she used to do on herself

didn't he though? i watched the scene again, and after he's done he looks guilty, and not very pleased with himself. also i think it's very telling the scene was shot covering alison's face completely, as noah has zero clue whether she's enjoying it, and doesn't seem to matter to him at all… until he's done.

men can be so ridiculous in the lengths they go to defend what they don't consider rape when they don't see kicking or screaming (and sometimes even then…). whatever you consider normal and fine it's your business, but putting your mouth on someone's genitals while they're sleeping IS rape.