In the books the scene is ambiguous, in the show, it isn't, and it's really troubling to me that the showrunners apparently couldn't see that. I just can't fathom the mental acrobatics necessary to perceive the scene as shown on TV as anything other than rape. You would have to believe that no means yes and that "she…

What makes killing in war different? The fact that your opponent signs up for it/gets a fair shot at killing you in turn? Two words: collateral damage.

Yeah, Marg is not my idea of a baby-sitter, no argument here either. What I'm getting at - both scenarios are unsettling, with various mitigating (Tommen is less isolated, Sansa is older) and aggravating (LF is a bona-fide creep, Cersei's protection can be counter-productive) circumstances that even somewhat out on…

"Once you find an excuse for murder you'll never be without one." - That's a pretty bleak outlook for every soldier returning from a war.

His interests in the sense that they wouldn't want him enthralled by Margary, not necessarily in the sense of his overall emotional well-being. But Margary knows that she's watched and that constrains her in a way Littlefinger isn't constrained. That's one of the reasons why her scenes with Tommen don't make me quite…

Tommen is also at home with his family, surrounded by people looking out for his interests and keeping an eye on Margary. Sansa is completely isolated and has no one but Littlefinger to turn to. She has no sexual experience either (at least not in the context of a consensual relationship - I hope you're not counting…

How is "I think he will die for his crimes and that's fine with me" sweeping anything under the rug?

For the record, I do think that book!Jaime too is up for some carmic come-uppance and any possible redemption would have to involve some sort of heroic self-sacrifice. Pretty sure that Jaime will die for his crimes and that's fine with me. I'm not suggesting that rape is worse than murder, even if Jaime might have…

I don't say it was _all_ about loyality/self defense, I said "there's an element of loyality/self defense to it." Of course Jaime was never supposed to be a paragon of virtue. His motives were never pure. But he used to have a certain moral ambiguity, which he now lacks in the show.

Reading the scene for what it is I see a woman who cries "No" and then never does anything to indicate that she has changed her mind and a man who says "I don't care". Really, there is no ambiguity here.

Really? I thought book!Sansa was incredibly stoic considering the circumstances. You can see that there's a lot of disassociation going on to keep the trauma at bay and her sanity intact.

It's a HBO show. Of course there's a promise of quality. Yes, their brand is all about being able to show nudity but it's also about prestige drama. And those two things can actually be compatible - lots of nudity in European arthouse cinema - but not in the way it's currently done on this show.

We don't have to imagine it; that's pretty much what we're getting with Sansa and Littlefinger. A lot of people have been drawing that parallell. Again, I don't see the double standard.

what? Just pointing out that it's not a double standard if one set of people have one standard, and one set of people have another. People who are okay with trivalizing rape generally couldn't see the big deal about last episode and think Tommen and Marg is a wet dream come true. People who aren't, mainly comment how…

Yeah, that hur-dur-get-it-boy reaction has been unsettling. But I would be very surprised if that's the same type of commenter who complained about the scene last episode. We're are talking about very different segments of the audience here.

Oh, that's all very obvious - they are not subtle at all about the "Rape as punishment for rejection/Jaime projecting all his guilt on Cersei and blaming her for corrupting him"-angle.

The show operates under different constraints than the books (eg. the need to keep a stronger focus on the core cast). It's true that the books themselves already have a lot of "filler" (table setting, side quests, while the main characters level up for the end-game), but I can see why the show isn't casting all those…

There's more to sex than p-in-v. Have a little imagination.

You could argue about the scene in the books, but on the show there's no ambiguity. She says no, and he says he doesn't care. Doesn't get more blatant than that.

I guess I just lack the imagination to come up with a pragmatic reason for rape.